well, i hope this is the place. had to do some searching and thinking. :)

Overview – from spiritual gifts

Before the fall of Satan, the Father consulted his Son in regard to the formation of man. They purposed to make this world, and create beasts and living things upon it, and to make man in the image of God, to reign as a ruling monarch over every living thing which God should create. When Satan learned the purpose of God, he was envious at Christ, and jealous because the Father had not consulted him in regard to the creation of man. Satan was of the highest order of angels; but Christ was above all. He was the commander of all Heaven. He imparted to the angelic family the high commands of his Father. The envy and jealousy of Satan increased. Until his rebellion all Heaven was in harmony, and perfect subjection to the government of God. Satan commenced to insinuate his dissatisfied feelings to other angels, and a number agreed to aid him in his rebellion. Satan was dissatisfied, with his position. Although very exalted, he aspires to be equal with God; and unless the Lord gratifies his ambition, determines to rebel, and refuse submission. He desires, yet dare not at once venture to make known his envious, hateful feelings. But he contents himself with gaining all he can to sympathize with him, as though deeply wronged. He relates to them his thoughts of warring against Jehovah. {3SG 36.1}

True, faithful angels, listening, hear the awful threats of Satan, and immediately report to their great commander. Christ tells them that he and the Father are acquainted with the purposes of Satan, and that they are forbearing only to see how many will unite with him to rebel against the government of God. He tells them that every purpose of Satan is understood. It was the highest crime to rebel against the government of God. All Heaven seemed in commotion. The angels were marshaled in companies, each with a higher commanding angel at their head. All the angels were astir. Satan was warring against the government of God, because ambitious to exalt himself and unwilling to submit to the authority of God's Son, Heaven's great commander. {3SG 37.1}

While some of the angels joined Satan in his rebellion, others reasoned with him to dissuade him from his purposes, contending for the honor and wisdom of God in giving authority to his Son. Satan urged, for what reason was Christ endowed with unlimited power and such high command above himself! He stood up proudly, and urged that he should be equal with God. He makes his boasts to his sympathizers that he will not submit to the authority of Christ. {3SG 37.2}

At length all the angels are summoned to appear before the Father, to have each case decided. Satan unblushingly makes known to all the heavenly family, his discontent, that Christ should be preferred before him, to be in such close conference with God, and he be uninformed as to the result of their frequent consultations. God informs Satan that this he can never know. That to his Son will he reveal his secret purposes, and that all the family of Heaven, Satan not excepted, were required to yield implicit obedience. Satan boldly speaks out his rebellion, and points to a large company who think God is unjust in not exalting him to be equal with God, and in not giving him command above Christ. He declares he cannot submit to be under Christ's command, that God's commands alone will he obey. Good angels weep to hear the words of Satan, and to see how he despises to follow the direction of Christ, their exalted and loving commander. {3SG 37.3}

The Father decides the case of Satan, and declares that he must be turned out of Heaven for his daring rebellion, and that all those who united with him in his rebellion, should be turned out with him. Then there was war in Heaven. Christ and his angels fought against Satan and his angels, for they were determined to remain in Heaven with all their rebellion. But they prevailed not. Christ and loyal angels triumphed, and drove Satan and his rebel sympathizers from Heaven. {3SG 38.1}

TERESAQ

THIS is a very good discription of how things
all stated..... and it was interesting that when
the loyal angels reported to GOD that GOD told them
that HE knew of Satan's plans already....

dgrimm60

"When Satan learned the purpose of God, he was envious at Christ, and jealous because the Father had not consulted him in regard to the creation of man."

pride!

satan wanted to be in on the decision making. he wanted control, to be one of the "administrators", if you will. (using these discussion boards to make it more "real". :) )

"Satan commenced to insinuate his dissatisfied feelings to other angels"

"he had so artfully instilled into their minds his own distrust and discontent that his agency was not discerned".

"... working ... to instill his own discontent into the minds of the angels ..... While secretly fomenting discord and rebellion, he with consummate craft caused it to appear as his sole purpose to promote loyalty and to preserve harmony and peace." {PP 38.2}

i wonder if we have an accurate picture of how this can be done? how many times has that happened to us and we were not aware of it, of having someone elses ideas "instilled into us" and we thinking it our own thought?

do we think satan was not "nice" while he was doing this? or did he come across as the most "loving" and "kind" being? when people are not kind, it is easy to see where they are coming from, but when a person has a practiced facade then it is most difficult. that is when we can become easy prey.

i ask this because decades ago a person "worked" in my life similarly to this. she was so "loving" and "kind" all the while working behind my back. things happened that i couldnt figure out how they had happened. things that the recipients of her actions are still suffering from decades later.

years later we, her "victims", got together each of us having a few pieces of the puzzle. put together we saw what had happened. i would like to say that i now know the difference between a truly loving and kind person and one who is only superficially loving and kind, but at first, no i dont. their actions little by little tell me but they have usually done their damage by the time i catch on.

but the point is we need to remember that a day will soon be coming when:
Disguised as an angel of light, he [Satan] will walk the earth as a wonder-worker. In beautiful language he will present lofty sentiments. Good words will be spoken by him, and good deeds performed. ... Notwithstanding this, so well will he counterfeit righteousness, that if it were possible, he would deceive the very elect. —RH Aug. 17, 1897. {TA 269.1}

he will be the kindest, most loving person anyone has ever seen....and the most devious....

TERESAQ

YES I am sure when Satan was talking to the angels
that he was talking in a nice loving way.....

as for the time now the people that will be
talking about sunday laws will also talk in a nice
and sweet way

this is why the true followers of JESUS must
stay in the bible

dgrimm60

Chap. 1 - Why was Sin Permitted?

"God is love." 1 John 4:16. His nature, His law, is love. It ever has been; it ever will be. "The high and lofty One that inhabiteth eternity," whose "ways are everlasting," changeth not. With Him "is no variableness, neither shadow of turning." Isaiah 57:15; Habakkuk 3:6; James 1:17. {PP 33.1}
Every manifestation of creative power is an expression of infinite love. The sovereignty of God involves fullness of blessing to all created beings. The psalmist says:

"Strong is Thy hand, and high is Thy right hand.
Righteousness and judgment are the foundation of Thy throne: Mercy and truth go before Thy face.
Blessed is the people that know the joyful sound: They walk, O Lord, in the light of Thy countenance.
In Thy name do they rejoice all the day: And in Thy righteousness are they exalted.
For Thou art the glory of their strength: . . . For our shield belongeth unto Jehovah, And our king to the Holy One."

NOTE: Psalm 89:13-18, R.V. [ IN THIS TEXT AND IN SOME OTHER BIBLE QUOTATIONS USED IN THIS BOOK THE WORD "JEHOVAH" IS EMPLOYED INSTEAD OF "LORD," AS RENDERED IN THE AMERICAN SUPPLEMENT TO THE REVISED VERSION.] {PP 33.2}

The history of the great conflict between good and evil, from the time it first began in heaven to the final overthrow of rebellion and the total eradication of sin, is also a demonstration of God's unchanging love. {PP 33.3}

TERESAQ

YES some people might see GOD'S PLAN to totally
distory sin as harsh but in reality it is showing
GOD'S LOVE

dgrimm60

The Sovereign of the universe was not alone in His work of beneficence. He had an associate--a co-worker who could appreciate His purposes, and could share His joy in giving happiness to created beings. "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. The same was in the beginning with God." John 1:1, 2. Christ, the Word, the only begotten of God, was one with the eternal Father--one in nature, in character, in purpose--the only being that could enter into all the counsels and purposes of God. "His name shall be called Wonderful, Counselor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace." Isaiah 9:6. His "goings forth have been from of old, from everlasting." Micah 5:2. And the Son of God declares concerning Himself: "The Lord possessed Me in the beginning of His way, before His works of old. I was set up from everlasting. . . . When He appointed the foundations of the earth: then I was by Him, as one brought up with Him: and I was daily His delight, rejoicing always before Him." Proverbs 8:22-30. {PP 34.1}

The Father wrought by His Son in the creation of all heavenly beings. "By Him were all things created, . . . whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by Him, and for Him." Colossians 1:16. Angels are God's ministers, radiant with the light ever flowing from His presence and speeding on rapid wing to execute His will. But the Son, the anointed of God, the "express image of His person," "the brightness of His glory," "upholding all things by the word of His power," holds supremacy over them all. Hebrews 1:3. "A glorious high throne from the beginning," was the place of His sanctuary (Jeremiah 17:12); "a scepter of righteousness," the scepter of His kingdom. Hebrews 1:8. "Honor and majesty are before Him: strength and beauty are in His sanctuary." Psalm 96:6. Mercy and truth go before His face. Psalm 89:14. {PP 34.2}


In the beginning, God was revealed in all the works of creation. It was Christ that spread the heavens, and laid the foundations of the earth. It was His hand that hung the worlds in space, and fashioned the flowers of the field. "His strength setteth fast the mountains." "The sea is His, and He made it." Psalm 65:6; 95:5. It was He that filled the earth with beauty, and the air with song. And upon all things in earth, and air, and sky, He wrote the message of the Father's love. {DA 20.1}

TERESAQ

YES a lot of people and even christians do not
understand the importance of JESUS as the creator
and as the charater of GOD the FATHER in humanity


dgrimm60

So long as all created beings acknowledged the allegiance of love, there was perfect harmony throughout the universe of God. It was the joy of the heavenly host to fulfill the purpose of their Creator. They delighted in reflecting His glory and showing forth His praise. And while love to God was supreme, love for one another was confiding and unselfish. There was no note of discord to mar the celestial harmonies. But a change came over this happy state. There was one who perverted the freedom that God had granted to His creatures. Sin originated with him who, next to Christ, had been most honored of God and was highest in power and glory among the inhabitants of heaven. Lucifer, "son of the morning," was first of the covering cherubs, holy and undefiled. He stood in the presence of the great Creator, and the ceaseless beams of glory enshrouding the eternal God rested upon him. "Thus saith the Lord God; Thou sealest up the sum, full of wisdom, and perfect in beauty. Thou hast been in Eden the garden of God; every precious stone was thy covering. . . . Thou art the anointed cherub that covereth; and I have set thee so: thou wast upon the holy mountain of God; thou hast walked up and down in the midst of the stones of fire. Thou wast perfect in thy ways from the day that thou wast created, till iniquity was found in thee." Ezekiel 28:12-15. {PP 35.1}

satan and the fallen angels are not immaterial beings.

Satan in Heaven, before his rebellion, was a high and exalted angel, next in honor to God's dear Son. His countenance, like those of the other angels, was mild and expressive of happiness. His forehead was high and broad, showing a powerful intellect. His form was perfect; his bearing noble and majestic. A special light beamed in his countenance, and shone around him brighter and more beautiful than around the other angels; yet Jesus, God's dear Son, had the pre-eminence over all the angelic host. He was one with the Father before the angels were created. Satan was envious of Christ, and gradually assumed command which devolved on Christ alone. {1SP 17.1}

TERESAQ

PRIDE is one of the many sins that will drag people
down fast.....let me pray to be humble

dgrimm60